Lets talk Health Care/Why we are going to kill old people.

[DW_Mobius]

Um I don't know were you got those numbers from . The overwhelming majority voted for a change in the health care policies .

Wow, actually I had a recent CNN article (~2 months) citing those numbers, along with several others, but down at the bottom of the article it's stating polls from 2006... Wasn't expecting that from CNN...

I don't buy that Americans without health insurance are happy they don't have it . Your going to have a hard time with that fact .

This is totally believable for me, as I am included in that number. I have no health/vision/dental/etc. atm, but I am working towards it with my job, and it makes perfect sense. I could've gone out and bought it privately already, but I'll save money waiting for my employer to offer coverage. What REALLY miffs me about this is that a significant portion of the uninsured (38%) make more than 50k a year, they simply don't buy any. I don't make that much annually, but I will be paying for THEIR insurance too in the end I'm sure.

I made the point to 64 year old man the other day that the Republicans never made an attempt to change healthcare in response to Medicare running out of funds. Funny thing was, he almost laughed at me. According to him, several years ago Bush was trying to get something moving on the issue, but he couldn't get the red and blue to cooperate. I don't know what the specifics were, he's retired and spends his time watching these things. I wouldn't doubt he is aware of something we are not. Not only that, but he absolutely hates medicare.

All I have to say is this, I 100% believe this is going to a f%@&ing trainwreck here in a few years if we vote this through in it's current form. It'll start off nice enough, but here in a few years, everybody from other countries who have posted in all the public forums and insisted that it is terrible in their country will say, "I told you so.."

TBH I don't really feel like continuing this discussion, I really REALLY hate politics...

[DW_Bomzin]

This is totally believable for me, as I am included in that number. I have no health/vision/dental/etc. atm, but I am working towards it with my job, and it makes perfect sense. I could've gone out and bought it privately already, but I'll save money waiting for my employer to offer coverage.

If you get sick tomorrow or something happens , god forbid , that attitude may change just alittle bit . The last time I visited an emergency room on a Sunday night came out costing me $850 for 4 stitch's . Your totally happy as long as you don't need services . After that little visit I felt like something was very wrong .

Waiting for your employer to offer coverage may be along wait. Unless your just waiting for the so long on the job thing and everyone else around you has it .

If you did go and get it yourself and actually had to use it for something major there is a good chance they would drop you like a hot potato or raise your premiums beyond what you could afford . Then once you have the pre-existing condition self coverage may just scare you $$ wise.

Lets do some googling around the world :

A new poll conducted by the Toronto-based Nanos Research points to overwhelming support — 86.2 percent — for strengthening public health care rather than expanding for-profit services.

“With more than 8 in 10 Canadians supporting public solutions to make public health care stronger, there is compelling evidence that Canadians across all demographics would prefer a public over a for-profit health care system,” said Nik Nanos, president of Nanos Research.

The Canadians seems somewhat happy .

Actually this turned into a hard google . But I did run across this , a 10 nation study health care poll .

Health Care Systems in Ten Developed Countries: The U.S. System Is Most Unpopular and Dutch System the Most Popular http://www.harrisinteractive.com/harris ... sp?PID=927And then there was this buried in that page. In all countries that Harris Interactive has surveyed two things appear to be true:

1. Regardless of what system a country has it falls far short of satisfying public expectations. Most systems always seem to be in a crisis or near crisis.
2. Governments in all countries are either changing or debating how to change their systems.


And on a final note and I think I'm done with this thread , yes I know your saying TG .

Read this link http://www.ucpress.edu/books/pages/1037 ... .intro.php


If millions of American children do not have reliable, basic health care, all children who attend American schools are at risk through daily exposure to untreated disease. If millions of restaurant and food industry workers do not have health insurance, people preparing food and waiting tables are sharing their health problems with everyone they serve. If uninsured residents of Texas routinely take unregulated courses of antibiotics from Mexico, antibiotic-resistant bacteria will develop and threaten us all. If tens of millions of Americans go without basic and preventive care, we all pay the bill when their health problems turn into complex medical emergencies necessitating expensive and specialized treatment. And if we condone a health care system that contributes to the formation of an untouchable caste of the ill, infirm, and marginally employed, all of us, as a society, will lose the right to feel pride in the democratic values that we claim to cherish.

[DW_Mobius]

post fail..

[DW_Mobius]

If you get sick tomorrow or something happens , god forbid , that attitude may change just alittle bit . The last time I visited an emergency room on a Sunday night came out costing me $850 for 4 stitch's . Your totally happy as long as you don't need services . After that little visit I felt like something was very wrong .

Ok, I'll stick around for one more.

1. I'm not fucking stupid. You're assertion is actually rather insulting, as I HATE people like that. Completely fine with the world as long as it's working for them, but god forbid something goes wrong, then the whole world is working against them. I know very well the consequences of being uninsured. Sorry my opinion is wrong.
2. I've been to the emergency room. I was in a car accident, that at the time, was not clear who was in the wrong, therefor I was uninsured. I told them this, they said ok, treated me before I bled to death, and I told them I would be getting in touch with them.
3. After it was ruled that it was not my fault, I returned with intensions to collect a bill to take to the other driver's insurance company. They told me not to bother, they had already written me off as charity.
4.Victoria (using her parents' health insurance) had to have laproscopic surgery last year. The lab the hospital used for bloodwork wasn't covered by their insurance company and she got a bill around $350 for it. All she did was call and explain that she wasn't covered and couldn't pay it, and they completely wrote it off. AND this happened again since she had to go in for a second surgery at the same hospital a couple months later.

Do I think that the outrageous bills were justified? Hell no. Do I think that we should go social? Hell no. Do I think the system works as well as it could? Hell no. Do I expect that I will be written off as charity everytime? No. Do I think I deserve to just be given healthcare without paying for it? No. Does it need to change? Yes.

I also know that as much as the lefties would love to insist, it's not like the system never works for anyone, anywhere, anytime. As stated above, there is almost always somewhere you can look for help, and in my case I didn't even look for it.

I never said I like the system as is, but I'd take it in a heartbeat over social. Again, I say heavily regulate it, but don't take complete fucking control over every aspect of it.

[JulianKingOfNothing]

What REALLY miffs me about this is that a significant portion of the uninsured (38%) make more than 50k a year, they simply don't buy any. I don't make that much annually, but I will be paying for THEIR insurance too in the end I'm sure.

And they'll be paying for you too.

[DW_Bomzin]

Sorry Mobi wasn't trying to be insulting not my intention , but your plan in the past , that has been working well , is to go for the free handout?

If they wrote you off as charity , someone is paying for it , either in higher premiums or the tax payer in the breaks they get .

Also I don't believe they are trying to take total control over it , just offer a better solution.

Truthfully I don't believe the democrats are going to be able to push this through . To much money against it , which is the same reason we will not see heavy regulations either . We may just be stuck with this system till it collapses and all the fat cat's make of with the prize.

What REALLY miffs me about this is that a significant portion of the uninsured (38%) make more than 50k a year, they simply don't buy any. I don't make that much annually, but I will be paying for THEIR insurance too in the end I'm sure.

And they'll be paying for you too.

Exactly. We're all in the same boat .

[DW_Damaged]

Warning offensive language.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=acLW1vFO-2Q[/youtube]

[DW_Damaged]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FIq_zv99jho[/youtube]

[JulianKingOfNothing]

ahaha tim hawkins :D

[DW_Damaged]

WTF!!!! Democrat Congresswoman Diane Watson Hearts Fidel Castro. Great just Freaking Great!!!!!

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IQe0Fd1rbj4[/youtube]