Can We Stop with Overloaded Adren Maps?

Sat Feb 28, 2009 1:42 am

I actually really hate the idea that you need to put goodies in a secret place to make it useful or something. The safer an area is, the fewer resources it should have for players, in my opinion.

Sat Feb 28, 2009 3:57 am

wail's got the idea of it, safe rooms should be just that... a room... thats safe...

not a super adrentime happy hour of infinite deemers and adrenaline with a little hole for your trans

Sat Feb 28, 2009 4:02 am

Instead of putting that stuff in a super secret hard to get to but loaded room, how about put it out in the open but with a huge risk factor like the redeemer and other goodies in Pathogen? If you really must have a huge adren pill, surround it with lava, put in air currents, moving spikes or whatever so you can grab it once but not camp it.

Sat Feb 28, 2009 9:14 am

but then wail, what's the point of having spawns? the lower lvls need them most, and if all spawns were like the ones on castlebreak they may as well not be there, because the lowbs would get mashed trying to mwm. surely there's a way to do this without ANY kind of nerf. Something which makes it harder for those who want it harder. I can't find a word for it, but it just seems like you'll make some people very unhappy for your own gain. I for one enjoy using my AM, but I like the low waves and don't want to whittle away the fist 10 waves camping a 10 adren 20 sec spawn and crap.

Sat Feb 28, 2009 9:49 am

Jons Return wrote:but then wail, what's the point of having spawns? the lower lvls need them most, and if all spawns were like the ones on castlebreak they may as well not be there, because the lowbs would get mashed trying to mwm. surely there's a way to do this without ANY kind of nerf. Something which makes it harder for those who want it harder. I can't find a word for it, but it just seems like you'll make some people very unhappy for your own gain. I for one enjoy using my AM, but I like the low waves and don't want to whittle away the fist 10 waves camping a 10 adren 20 sec spawn and crap.

Jon you make the assumption that it is a right to have these things and you need them. You don't need them, and your logic is flawed if a noob does not have access to them or is just starting how can they miss what they never had. You are not contributing to the debate on the the server your being dense. If you are not out killing the first 8-10 waves and are sitting on an adren spawn somewhere trying to make weapons you will never level in the next 10 years. and you will always be low level.

Continuing a thread topic about another server when it was proven that it's not the levels it's the way maps are constructed that determines real playability. Not the need for a higher server level. Do you not get it or do you ignor what you don't want to see?

:banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :sign6: :banghead:

Sat Feb 28, 2009 1:27 pm

i get more exp in waves 1-7/8 than i do for the whole rest of the game (not counting linking franky for luci)

Sat Feb 28, 2009 2:32 pm

WailofSuicide wrote:I actually really hate the idea that you need to put goodies in a secret place to make it useful or something. The safer an area is, the fewer resources it should have for players, in my opinion.

Well this is my philosophy of this:

For an easy map:
A safe room should be available regardless whenever you find a secret or not. However, the goodies shouldn't be in the safe spot where everyone hides.
If this map scenario happens to have a super secret (not a little hole in wall where everyone will fight to shoot their trans in), the goodies should be in there, but don't over do it. Another thing I might add is to NOT make it an isolated room. The room (like in BluePrint) ruins the map. You should associate the secret with the map some way. As Seven pointed out, leave some exposure to it. You DO want to balance risk & reward... The greater the risk the better the reward. If you don't want people to get hurt in there, then you better at least make it risky to get in there (An example: you first must jump over the lava, then avoid the crocodiles' teeth, walk along the rope while not looking down, then avoid Nutcracker's Vorpal attacks lol).
& don't be cheesy and place an exit teleporter from the secret. That's just like holding hands while crossing the street.

For a hard map:
Don't provide a safe room lol. If you are making a secret, don't put stuff in there; simply make the secret into the only decent shelter available. Not super safe, decent to little shelter. Since your map is already tough to survive out there, your secret is already worth finding because you have a chance in winning ;)

To place this in shorter terms:
Do NOT junk up your map with --- junk. Or else either your secret is obsolete or your secret will be competing with the rest of the map & you just found yourself making a landfill.

One last thing I might add is the Sticky Hornet made. I do agree in what he says so pleeeease check this out if you're new to mapping:
http://clandw.org/distribution/viewtopi ... =11&t=1094

Sat Feb 28, 2009 4:26 pm

D2Boss wrote:. If you don't want people to get hurt in there, then you better at least make it risky to get in there (An example: you first must jump over the lava, then avoid the crocodiles' teeth, walk along the rope while not looking down, then avoid Nutcracker's Vorpal attacks lol).

This is all negated by flight weps and boots of flight (except Nutty attacks - there's no defense for that)

D2Boss wrote:& don't be cheesy and place an exit teleporter from the secret. That's just like holding hands while crossing the street.

What if you got in the room through a teleporter? How might you get out without one?

Sat Feb 28, 2009 4:51 pm

DW_BrainPan wrote:
D2Boss wrote:& don't be cheesy and place an exit teleporter from the secret. That's just like holding hands while crossing the street.
What if you got in the room through a teleporter? How might you get out without one?

Well, if there is no other way players can get to it & the room is some how associated with the map, then I guess it's alright. Just be sure you don't place deemer lockers like they did in Watch yer Back & Suburban, and be extra light on the adren. Have the ams undergo a little consequence for taking the easy way to get adren....little patience lesson never hurts ;)

Sat Feb 28, 2009 11:31 pm

Every discussion on topics like this seem to turn in to what is in the best interests of lower level players vs. higher level players. I mostly just read the posts and let it go, but I guess I’m finally go to throw in my 2 cents – and this may be a little off topic, but wtf. It sure seems to me like lower levels want everything handed to them on a platter – ez hiding spots full of thousands of adren pills & super weapons just sitting there for the taking – well to bad, for all of the lower level players reading this, you don’t know how easy you have it, when the MM server started it was hard to level up, there were few easy maps, and it was rare to defeat Luci. Nowadays, not winning is rare & the concept of teamwork is almost totally out the window. I’ll admit to being part of the not playing as a team problem, as it is now almost nothing can kill me, so why should I cluster in an area and work with other players to defeat a wave, and that it is how it should be – everyone working together to win – waves 12-16 should be a lot, lot harder than they are & as a group we should probably be winning only 50% of the maps played, not like the 95% it must be now. My idea, and I don’t know if this is possible, have some adren available for the first say 4 or 5 waves, then dramatically reduce the amount of pills sitting around, and then players better be out killing monsters.

Anyway, sorry for the rambling, but like I said before that’s my 2 cents.

Bandito :rr: