What if there were no low levels on INV?

[DW_FrankyTheFly]

If I understand well, Wail told me that the new piercing (the one that goes to +10) was the same power has the old one (the one that goes to +6). So i am presulming that since the maximum damage you can acheive with piercing is 30%, it must mean that the one that goes to +10 was 3% per + (10 x 3 = 30%) and that the one that goes to +6 is 5% per + (6 x 5 = 30%).

I prefer the old piercing (the one that goes to +6) for 2 reasons. First, you can use the triple on it and second it's just easier to max with an EWC when no AM are around (going from a piercing +4 to a piercing +6 is easier then going up to a +10 has an example).

[Seven_of_69]

I'm at a huge loss here because IMO piercing was working just fine (as I indicated with anecdotes) and you (and apparently Franky) said it sucked. With the recent update, now that the "new" piercing (isn't it just the old one brought back?) is here, you love it but I don't. And if you ask Wail, isn't there absolutely no difference between the old-old (1-6) and the new-now-old (1-10) (other than being able to triple it or not)? Or have the formulas and code actually changed? Case in point: last night I seemed to be doing absolutely no damage to level 335+ monsters with (maxed) Piercing Rockets+6 yet in the past I've used (maxed) Piercing Rockets+10 and done loads of damage. I'd swear that last night I had plain rox, they did almost no damage.

Let me know if I should look into this. The functionality between the two is a tiny bit different, but there really should not be any practical difference between the two as far as the Piercing effect itself.

Thanks for keeping up on this. Something indeed seems really wrong. Earlier today on FrostDeck17, I had piercing MP5+6 and I could not do any damage to level 338 moles on wave 4. Their health meter simply wouldn't go down, not even a single HP. I thought I was throwing nerf balls at them! :sspeechless: Oddly enough, on the same wave and monster level, I was able to some damage to the small Skaarj bipeds.

Franky, your explanation makes sense. Thanks for the insight.

[krneki]

I still don't get this - piercing was supposed to IGNORE monster's damage reduction - but I haven't noticed that yet :/

[JulianKingOfNothing]

I still don't get this - piercing was supposed to IGNORE monster's damage reduction - but I haven't noticed that yet :/

I might be mistaken, but I think it ignores the monster's shield.

[DW_FrankyTheFly]

Piercing partially ignore DR, not totally. In fact, to be efficient on monster with 300+ level only piercing +12 or +14 (with the DMM) can do some damage. Piercing +6 will work on monster bellow like level 150 but after that, its not efficient. I still recommand energy weapon over piercing on high level monster.

[warhead2]

This sure is a long thread with lots of debate but we are getting somewhere so this is cool.

I would also like to point out that piercing is now *copyable*. This also was requested and now we have that and I want to call out a big huge THANK YOU and lots of love to the admins/coders :cheers:

Franky what you said about +6 being better and easier to manager than +10 makes a lot of sense, another good point about why the "old" piercing is better and i agree.

i'm with you too about using nrg with high levels, and this usually works unless the level is really high, then nrg is useless also, which is why my idea of a cap would work, as an upper limit there would keep nrg working fine. someone said we would not want to increase nrg strength and this is not an issue. the suggestion is not to incrase nrg strength, but by capping monster level, nrg remains effective. would be nice to have, but now with triple working with piercing, the situation is much improved at least.

Now, everyone is seeing what I have been seeing about piercing, that the effect weakens as the monster level goes up. Seven you are saying you are seeing the weak effect right now, but I am saying I have been seeing this for a while now and it's exactly what turned me off about peircing, plus the fact that you could not triple it(that issue being solved now).

So yes Wail can you pls look into this further, and also get down exactly how piercing should work. isn't it supposed to completely ignore DR? if so, then things don't appear to be working right. i would expect both the amount of damage, damage/xp meter rate, and hit sounds, to remain the same regardless of monster level when using a piercing, if it is supposed to ignore DR.

Thanks

[Seven_of_69]

I would also like to point out that piercing is now *copyable*. This also was requested and now we have that and I want to call out a big huge THANK YOU and lots of love to the admins/coders

Piercing was always copyable.

i'm with you too about using nrg with high levels, and this usually works unless the level is really high, then nrg is useless also, which is why my idea of a cap would work, as an upper limit there would keep nrg working fine. someone said we would not want to increase nrg strength and this is not an issue. the suggestion is not to incrase nrg strength, but by capping monster level, nrg remains effective. would be nice to have, but now with triple working with piercing, the situation is much improved at least.

I don't agree with capping the monster level. And if energy is always effective, isn't that just the I WIN button I've mentioned?

Now, everyone is seeing what I have been seeing about piercing, that the effect weakens as the monster level goes up. Seven you are saying you are seeing the weak effect right now, but I am saying I have been seeing this for a while now and it's exactly what turned me off about peircing, plus the fact that you could not triple it(that issue being solved now).

I have not been able to look at this for several days so unless something has changed, I stand by my previous findings. Piercing used to work fine regardless of monster level. Even a non-maxed piercing did the job (I point once again to Holy Shard kills on wave 13 using piercing link+5 against level 520 monsters). Numbers are much more convincing than adjectives. :swink: Finally piercing did all that without needing a triple.

[warhead2]

IMO piercing weapons should be shared and copied just like energy. :sbigsmile:

u said it not me

no, nrg is not effective at all when levels are very high.

i stand by what i said too. maybe what you found were different condiations where somehow it worked ok for you, but for me and others, we have not had the same experience. maybe our experiences occured on different versions of the software so it behaved differently each time, etc etc, so many things can effect this. hopefully Wail can get to the bottom of this.

[DW_WailofSuicide]

I have not been able to look at this for several days so unless something has changed, I stand by my previous findings. Piercing used to work fine regardless of monster level. Even a non-maxed piercing did the job (I point once again to Holy Shard kills on wave 13 using piercing link+5 against level 520 monsters). Numbers are much more convincing than adjectives. :swink: Finally piercing did all that without needing a triple.

Yep, I just looked at this the other day testing with a level 1500 character, the Piercing (0-10) worked fine at this level, but the Piercing (-2-6) was being reduced to basically nothing, so need to look a bit more and see why that may be the case.

no, nrg is not effective at all when levels are very high.

Why should they be? Energy weapons being effective = Players being invulnerable. As if Energy weapons weren't dominant enough, and player invulnerability & monster time out weren't cheesy already.

[Seven_of_69]

IMO piercing weapons should be shared and copied just like energy. :sbigsmile:

u said it not me

Perhaps the context of my original statement wasn't clear. First of all, piercing weapons were always copyable. That isn't new. My comment was based how IMO players should share their piercing weapons.