I noticed that the MP5 is gone and my weapon speed has been lowered.
Any reason why?
New changes
enuf with the comedy hehe
1) the mp5 was never designed to have it's WS pumped up. it was unbalanced with a 3x firerate. there's plenty of anecdotes/examples that i'll let others share. (like K with max WS and mp5 can nonstop power a triple dam).
2) 3x weapon speed by itself is pretty unbalancing. nightwolf with any weapon was killing EVERYTHING on The End last night. he was killing so much that i couldn't get enuf energy from my minelayer to power my globe for any length of time.
there's other changes coming i bet, whether game or playerside, to balance the game wtih the level of players and their stats. mp5 + 200 ws is just the first im' sure.
1) the mp5 was never designed to have it's WS pumped up. it was unbalanced with a 3x firerate. there's plenty of anecdotes/examples that i'll let others share. (like K with max WS and mp5 can nonstop power a triple dam).
2) 3x weapon speed by itself is pretty unbalancing. nightwolf with any weapon was killing EVERYTHING on The End last night. he was killing so much that i couldn't get enuf energy from my minelayer to power my globe for any length of time.
there's other changes coming i bet, whether game or playerside, to balance the game wtih the level of players and their stats. mp5 + 200 ws is just the first im' sure.
Here is the problem though. When someone is at twice the level as everyone else, that person is going to dominate no matter what. And with the incremental increase of points needed for leveling up, they have to dominate or else they won't level up. So, it is not like they can just sit there and not do anything because it would take them forever to level up.
How are other servers solving this problem? I have played on ones that have spreading, infinite link guns. They also have very little requirements for leveling up. It seems to me that the solution is making the monsters harder.
Should we be getting to Luci every map? Because that is what happens when the 8-10 of us over level 75 are in at night. What about deemer monsters and such?
I am not trying to bitch or anything. Just looking for answers. If the game is going to be continually rebalanced so that low level players are more involved than what is the point of gaining levels to be a high level player?
I want to get to the point where I can take a freakin rock to the head or knock out a queen in a couple of shots. That is why you level up. But, if I am going to be dropped back down consistantly than what is the point?
This, I think, is a general problem with RPGs. At somepoint your opponent needs to be growning as powerful as you. Which is why the traditional story based RPG has an ending. Evercrack and WoW suffer the same problems.
How are other servers solving this problem? I have played on ones that have spreading, infinite link guns. They also have very little requirements for leveling up. It seems to me that the solution is making the monsters harder.
Should we be getting to Luci every map? Because that is what happens when the 8-10 of us over level 75 are in at night. What about deemer monsters and such?
I am not trying to bitch or anything. Just looking for answers. If the game is going to be continually rebalanced so that low level players are more involved than what is the point of gaining levels to be a high level player?
I want to get to the point where I can take a freakin rock to the head or knock out a queen in a couple of shots. That is why you level up. But, if I am going to be dropped back down consistantly than what is the point?
This, I think, is a general problem with RPGs. At somepoint your opponent needs to be growning as powerful as you. Which is why the traditional story based RPG has an ending. Evercrack and WoW suffer the same problems.
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DW_WailofSuicide
- DW Clan Member
- Posts: 1634
- Joined: Wed Dec 28, 2005 12:00 am
"The Grind" and difficulty/scaling issue are a consistent problem for every multiplayer RPG. Kind of why I favor, at least in multiplayer, a low level cap with players mixing and matching a few abilities from a large pool -- Not everyone has multiple hours to play each day, and keeping up with the Joneses isn't fun.zeus wrote:Here is the problem though. When someone is at twice the level as everyone else, that person is going to dominate no matter what. And with the incremental increase of points needed for leveling up, they have to dominate or else they won't level up. So, it is not like they can just sit there and not do anything because it would take them forever to level up.
How are other servers solving this problem? I have played on ones that have spreading, infinite link guns. They also have very little requirements for leveling up. It seems to me that the solution is making the monsters harder.
Should we be getting to Luci every map? Because that is what happens when the 8-10 of us over level 75 are in at night. What about deemer monsters and such?
I am not trying to bitch or anything. Just looking for answers. If the game is going to be continually rebalanced so that low level players are more involved than what is the point of gaining levels to be a high level player?
I want to get to the point where I can take a freakin rock to the head or knock out a queen in a couple of shots. That is why you level up. But, if I am going to be dropped back down consistantly than what is the point?
This, I think, is a general problem with RPGs. At somepoint your opponent needs to be growning as powerful as you. Which is why the traditional story based RPG has an ending. Evercrack and WoW suffer the same problems.
I agree. I think that that is why some people get addicted to EQ and WoW and others just give it up. It is not worth playing just for the sake of trying to keep up with others. You want to play to have fun.
*This is taking into account ZERO damage bonus and Weapon speed bonus.*
MP5 damage per second (DPS). Formula for reload rate on mp5 is 1/.1660
25 damage with ~6 BPS = 160 DPS
Link for comparison.
9 Damage with 8.333 BPS = 75 DPS
With 200% WSB.
MP5 damage per second
25 damage with 18 BPS = 450 DPS
Link for comparison.
9 Damage with ~25 BPS = ~225 DPS
With 300 DB and 200 WSB. (Damage bonus is .5%)
MP5 damage per second
62.5 damage with 18 BPS = 1125 DPS
Link for comparison.
22.5 Damage with ~25 BPS = ~562.5 DPS.
Medics can easily create infinite MP5s, adrenaline from monster kills + drip makes Triple damage pretty easy to sustain. So these values can be tripled across the board. Mp5 is hitscan so no travel time like link. Monsters aren't adjusted AFAIK with consideration to player levels.
I have to double check these values, but it makes sense to me right now.
MP5 damage per second (DPS). Formula for reload rate on mp5 is 1/.1660
25 damage with ~6 BPS = 160 DPS
Link for comparison.
9 Damage with 8.333 BPS = 75 DPS
With 200% WSB.
MP5 damage per second
25 damage with 18 BPS = 450 DPS
Link for comparison.
9 Damage with ~25 BPS = ~225 DPS
With 300 DB and 200 WSB. (Damage bonus is .5%)
MP5 damage per second
62.5 damage with 18 BPS = 1125 DPS
Link for comparison.
22.5 Damage with ~25 BPS = ~562.5 DPS.
Medics can easily create infinite MP5s, adrenaline from monster kills + drip makes Triple damage pretty easy to sustain. So these values can be tripled across the board. Mp5 is hitscan so no travel time like link. Monsters aren't adjusted AFAIK with consideration to player levels.
I have to double check these values, but it makes sense to me right now.
Although i do like your suggestion wail. That is probably unsupported with druids RPG currently. TBH i don't know what was added in terms of abilites other then the concept of classes.
The main thing here is there is little adjustment to make it tougher for higher level players. Yes this kind of kills it for lower ones, but hey thats the game. We put it up with it over at UI, remember there were players like monster owner who used to come in and make it nearly impossible to play. That can be an issue here, but we can control it.
Regardless how you look at it, the MP5 is currently way to strong. It should be weaker then then mini IMHO. Especially with the 3 quasi fire modes. We should have just pulled it like was suggested when the hole mp5 berserk discussion.
The main thing here is there is little adjustment to make it tougher for higher level players. Yes this kind of kills it for lower ones, but hey thats the game. We put it up with it over at UI, remember there were players like monster owner who used to come in and make it nearly impossible to play. That can be an issue here, but we can control it.
Regardless how you look at it, the MP5 is currently way to strong. It should be weaker then then mini IMHO. Especially with the 3 quasi fire modes. We should have just pulled it like was suggested when the hole mp5 berserk discussion.
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DW_Ifondlesweaters
- DW Clan Member
- Posts: 326
- Joined: Mon Dec 26, 2005 12:00 am
Maybe we should all just start playing FREON... :cheers:
:icescream:
THAW ME!!! :violent2:
:icescream:
THAW ME!!! :violent2:
Do you have the numbers for mini and shock? I would especially be interested in the shock numbers.DW_Hornet wrote:*This is taking into account ZERO damage bonus and Weapon speed bonus.*
MP5 damage per second (DPS). Formula for reload rate on mp5 is 1/.1660
25 damage with ~6 BPS = 160 DPS
Link for comparison.
9 Damage with 8.333 BPS = 75 DPS
With 200% WSB.
MP5 damage per second
25 damage with 18 BPS = 450 DPS
Link for comparison.
9 Damage with ~25 BPS = ~225 DPS
With 300 DB and 200 WSB. (Damage bonus is .5%)
MP5 damage per second
62.5 damage with 18 BPS = 1125 DPS
Link for comparison.
22.5 Damage with ~25 BPS = ~562.5 DPS.
Medics can easily create infinite MP5s, adrenaline from monster kills + drip makes Triple damage pretty easy to sustain. So these values can be tripled across the board. Mp5 is hitscan so no travel time like link. Monsters aren't adjusted AFAIK with consideration to player levels.
I have to double check these values, but it makes sense to me right now.
Medics can easily do that, but that is the only thing they can do. As a medic I can create an inf weapon that allows me to heal people. If it is not a spash weapon, then I cannot heal myself, thereby not being of use to anyone. Keep in mind, that weapon has no extra powers. So, it is not a +6 freezing or a +9 vorpal or whatever. It is just an inf weapon as far as offense goes.
Weapons masters, when they build up resupply and the all weapons thing (forget what it is called) basically have inf for all of their weapons. Yeah, they have to switch around a bit. But, between the flack, link, mines, and shock, you are essentially never running out of ammo. Plus, those are all power weapons.
Adren masters with their drip and the constant resupply of adren on half of the maps can generate whatever weapons they want for the first 6-8 levels. On the protected adrens they can sit there the whole map. Then, with their globes and other "shineys" can go out there and do a whole host of things.
Each position has its strengths and weaknesses. And a lot of that has to do with the current map. Before the MP5 came along, I would die just looking for a decent weapon when you spawned in at level 10. On some maps, the lockers would have everything you need and it was right there. Other maps, the weapon that you want is on the other side of the map with 20 queens between you and it.
Ultimately, I think that once the characters are leveled up, the weapons masters will be the most powerful.