Weapon Limitation Volume

[superchav]

Oh and wat u think of my new sig?

You're very good with photoshop :thumbleft: . Though there's no heli in UT. Yet.

Lol it is a BF2 signature, i shall make a UT one later, thanks for the praise.

[40_Shards]

May I ask 40_Shards why you would want to imbalance the entire game by distorting the wep master by removing weapons. This doesnt make since to my obviously small mind. Rather than just making the game appear harder you would be distorting the designed balance of the game.
You must be a medic or a adren master. If your goal is to make the game harder just turn up the monsters. I will bet we can do that for you.
Am I missing a goal here? You need to remember that a adren master can up his or her few weapons. The weapons master plays with what he or she gets. And no I dont accept that a adren can fix up the wm s guns. I have played many maps where there was no adren master to help or the ones that were in game were DICKS and would not help. FYI I play mostly adren master now but still play wp at times. Cheap. We have maps now that classes of players leave the server because of the map and guns available. Is this our goal? I dont think so.

If there was a map which took away all my AM's artifacts just for the hell of it I wouldn't be happy either. But if it not only did this to balance out the map, but left me with the ones very much needed by an AM, then it could be justified.

If there there was another survival map (like Kotam) on the server designed with only a few weapons available, without the volume, and there were a small number of WMs playing on the map, one of the following is inevitable:
a. The WMs, most with a full bar of weapons, completely own the map. Many of the other players become bored and leave.
b. The WMs get flooded with weapon requests. Either the WMs become sick of this and leave, or some MMs and AMs don't get the weapons they want, get bored of asking and leave.

With the volume, the WMs would still have more weaps than the other classes, but would get far less weapon requests and, though advantaged, woudn't completely own.

Rather than just making the game appear harder you would be distorting the designed balance of the game.

This isn't intended to distort the balance at all, as it's very good. It is designed to reduce their advantage so that MMs and AMs stand a chance against them, balancing out a map which would otherwise be completely biased.


Anyway, the mappers we have here are very good. If I knew they were going to use this to make useless maps that everyone hates I wouldn't have posted it here in the first place. It's up to them to use it in ways that are both creative and unbiased.

Lol it is a BF2 signature, i shall make a UT one later, thanks for the praise.

Hehe. It looks quite like UT3.

[superchav]

Yup, 40shards makes a great point, on maps which are designed so u can only pick up like 1 weapon, or 1 weapon you dont get (TicTacToe) where every one begs WM's for the Link gun, the blocking volume would remove it from them aswell so that that weapon taken away makes the map harder, its a great idea. and up to the mapper if they want to risk their map being hated and not played or if they think it will make it fairer.

[DW_WailofSuicide]

If there was a map which took away all my AM's artifacts just for the hell of it I wouldn't be happy either. But if it not only did this to balance out the map, but left me with the ones very much needed by an AM, then it could be justified.

40_Shards, do you even play on Monster Mash? What maps do you think are in need of "balancing" by frustrating players and making the weapons they have useless, and screwing up monsters?

Do you really think it's a good idea to give players a weapon and then have that weapon fail to work? I think it's one thing to not have a weapon available at all on a map, it's another thing entirely to give people that weapon and have it not work.

If there there was another survival map (like Kotam) on the server designed with only a few weapons available, without the volume, and there were a small number of WMs playing on the map, one of the following is inevitable:
a. The WMs, most with a full bar of weapons, completely own the map. Many of the other players become bored and leave.
b. The WMs get flooded with weapon requests. Either the WMs become sick of this and leave, or some MMs and AMs don't get the weapons they want, get bored of asking and leave.

With the volume, the WMs would still have more weaps than the other classes, but would get far less weapon requests and, though advantaged, woudn't completely own.

Again, do you even play on Monster Mash? Kotam has all the weapons. It even has a Mine Layer. I don't think Kotam is really a good example of (A) "Weapon masters 'completely own' the map with other players getting bored and leaving." I've also never seen (B) in the sense of Weapon masters getting sick of weapon requests and leaving.

I have seen childish players leave because a map doesn't have mine layers in every weapon locker for them, or because it doesn't have ridiculous amounts of adrenaline lying around in safe spots so they can gain endless no-risk experience. But I'm not sure how hamstringing weapon masters is supposed to increase other players' skill and maturity levels.

Anyway, the mappers we have here are very good. If I knew they were going to use this to make useless maps that everyone hates I wouldn't have posted it here in the first place. It's up to them to use it in ways that are both creative and unbiased.

Anything that makes monsters nonfunctional is completely unacceptable. And you're being a bit glib on the monsters you think it will effect - It's more than you think.

I also think you need to take a look at how much weapon masters pay for loaded weapons. Hint: It's significantly more expensive than loaded artifacts or loaded medic. And it's one of the most-disprespected skills in the game, because a huge number of maps on this server give out every single weapon in a weapon locker, to the point where we have people complaining about picking up weapons they don't want. Maybe we should have artifact lockers where weapon masters can go and pick up all the artifacts for free?

Just to be clear here, since you seem to have a hard time distinguishing rhetoric from actual suggestions: That's also not acceptable for maps on this server.

[DW_Cheapshot]

And ultamatley it is the player that makes the final decision.
Look at the list of maps and those that get played compared to those that don't get played at all. We might have what is perceived to be the greatest map of all time and never gets voted.

[superchav]

Good points, but i think the way shards was putting it across was, If a map such as tictactoe was designed specifically so players would have to cope without something or other, then this would be a good way to do it.

And the point i made was making the weapon not work, would be stupid, and annoying, would be to get the volume to remove the weapon from inventory, which can be done.

[40_Shards]

What maps do you think are in need of "balancing"

None. This is meant for new maps.

Do you really think it's a good idea to give players a weapon and then have that weapon fail to work?

Anything that makes monsters nonfunctional is completely unacceptable. And you're being a bit glib on the monsters you think it will effect - It's more than you think.

This was never a final version. It was an idea.

Thinking about it, the code to distinguish monsters and players is very easy. I'd just need to find it.

If there there was another survival map (like Kotam) on the server designed with only a few weapons available
not
If there there was another survival map on the server designed with only a few weapons available (like Kotam)

Maybe we should have artifact lockers where weapon masters can go and pick up all the artifacts for free?

A number of recent maps have had artifact pickups, and they regularly drop from monsters. I'd have no problem with it though.

Just to be clear here, since you seem to have a hard time distinguishing rhetoric from actual suggestions: That's also not acceptable for maps on this server.

Please make yourself clearer next time.

Good points, but i think the way shards was putting it across was, If a map such as tictactoe was designed specifically so players would have to cope without something or other, then this would be a good way to do it.

Exactly.

[DW_Cheapshot]

You did know that tic tac toe does not have a link gun. Guess what happens?
All of the adren masters and medics plead for links. You know what happens next. You have no idea how many peeps we have kicked etc dieing and coming back over and over to pass out weps. We are even having teams come in now just to distribute weps and artifacts to each other. Watch what the SDs are doing and how they play. This would be in server 2. People come unglued when they perceive that they have lost something they thing they have earned. Look at the maps with missing guns, the players find a way or leave. Oh and nothing wrong with the way the SDs play it shows great team work. I do agree conceptualizing is good but we must be care full what we implement.

[DW_Ant]

I've been seeing alotta SD's lately. Where they from? Do they have an account here? But I find it cool to see a whole set of players joining us :D

[superchav]

Yes and the pleads for link guns on such maps would not happen if volumes were added which remove that certain weapon from the inventory of that map.